Financial Independence Daily FI discussion thread - June 18, 2019 |
- Daily FI discussion thread - June 18, 2019
- So you graduated college at the age ~22 and you found yourself a decent job. If you're able to max out your 401k and IRA for 10 years with 6% returns, your retirement funds will be worth ~$349,291. That amount by itself will be worth $3,441,145 after 35 years by the time you're 67.
- One of the things I'm looking forward to most with FI: Avoiding Commuting
- I know I am FIREing in 10 months. But it’s getting harder and harder to be motivated at work.
- Options for US citizen fire'ing overseas? (no job, pension, young)
- FI, corporate grind/burnout, and life balance. Does it get any better?
- Instructions for family if I die before FIRE
- Cincinnati, Dayton, Northern Kentucky showing "Playing With Fire".
- Does it make sense to keep maxing out my 401k if I'm retiring in ~5 years?
- Life extension costs and FIRE
- Are you happy?
- What is the best stock to invest in?
- My wealthy financially independent family member wants to invest with me... help!
- A quick point of clarification on tax on gains in after tax money in 401k ?
- FIRE Age with Kids
- How long will I live INDEPENDENTLY in retirement?
| Daily FI discussion thread - June 18, 2019 Posted: 18 Jun 2019 01:09 AM PDT Please use this thread to have discussions which you don't feel warrant a new post to the sub. While the Rules for posting questions on the basics of personal finance/investing topics are relaxed a little bit here, the rules against memes/spam/self-promotion/excessive rudeness/politics still apply! Have a look at the FAQ for this subreddit before posting to see if your question is frequently asked. Since this post does tend to get busy, consider sorting the comments by "new" (instead of "best" or "top") to see the newest posts. [link] [comments]  |
| Posted: 18 Jun 2019 06:35 AM PDT Edit: The future value after 35 years from $349K is ~$2,684,681 Edit 2: Max out your HSA if your employer offers it and if you're healthy. That money helps when you're old when you really need healthcare. You will be set for retirement after 10 years of hard work! I would contribute enough money to get the employer match for 401k and Roth is tax-free investing. It would be a good idea to continue to work until you're 65 when you're eligible for Medicaid because paying for Healthcare yourself is extremely costly. It helps to stay over your folks' place for a while. Staying over their place may not be pleasant, but it beats working at Home Depot when you're old and you're forced to stay late because your supervisor wanted to do your performance evaluations. I wish I started on this path many years ago. I started 6 years late... Compounding interest is your friend! The first 10 years investing, is worth more than the next 30 years you put in. http://www.moneychimp.com/calculator/compound_interest_calculator.htm My salary is $41,600/yr. I give parents $500/mo for rent. Another $500 goes towards savings and $100 for fun. [link] [comments]  |
| One of the things I'm looking forward to most with FI: Avoiding Commuting Posted: 18 Jun 2019 06:25 AM PDT So I had a dangerous idiot tailgating me this morning and it really pissed me off. He was flying down the highway going likely 20+ over as I was mid passing someone in the center lane. Did he back off the gas and wait a little to see if I'd go around? Nope, right on my ass a foot away so I sped up to get away from him. He was one of those assholes that drives like he is the only one that matters. This is the same type that makes working less bearable. I actually debated WFH today, but I didn't as I can only do it so often. So maybe I'll do it tomorrow. I cannot wait to be free from these types. [link] [comments]  |
| I know I am FIREing in 10 months. But it’s getting harder and harder to be motivated at work. Posted: 17 Jun 2019 04:56 PM PDT This is not the post to talk about numbers/dollars/cents. It's about how to manage this unsettling state of the pre FIRE months. I can't sit still at work. I am starting to feel unmotivated. Little things at work annoy me. 10 months is still a long time. How do you get your mindset right so that going to work isn't a torture? [link] [comments]  |
| Options for US citizen fire'ing overseas? (no job, pension, young) Posted: 18 Jun 2019 11:16 AM PDT In researching visa's country by country, i'm not really seeing any viable options for retiring overseas using the FIRE approach. In looking at safe, low cost countries to retire in, it seems that a FIRE based retirement won't meet the visa requirements. - Some have a minimum age of 45, 50, OR 66 (i'm 35) - Some simply have a working requirement that has to be meet until citizenship is achieved. As retiring young with self investing is relatively rare, googling is yielding no results. Is there a good resource for potential countries friendly to a younger retirement with investments rather than a guaranteed pension? [link] [comments]  |
| FI, corporate grind/burnout, and life balance. Does it get any better? Posted: 18 Jun 2019 09:36 AM PDT One of the benefits often talked about in working towards and achieving FIRE is to find balance in the things that you do and to build a life you want and save for it. This can mean wildly different things to different people. One of the toughest things throughout the journey after living, working, and discovering FIRE is trying to figure out how to make a corporate career feel alright and feasible while creating balance in your life. I understand that this is a very first-worldly issue to talk about, but nevertheless, here we are. This is also a long post, so if you do struggle with a corporate career and what it involves, you may find some discussion points here and I encourage you to please start them. People on this board often express that "work does not define them" and similar attitudes about work that seems like people are coasting by in their jobs. I'm wondering how this is possible in the current corporate environment. An environment that seems like it wants to squeeze every ounce of energy out of you, and then spit you out when you are spent. Expectations are high, and if you aren't performing to their standards, you probably will start getting less work, then get a PIP etc. It seems like the message today is to just grind away, and people are eating up this way of thinking. In trying to find a balance in my own life, I find that I care less and less about my corporate career as time goes by and having to find ways to cope with everything that comes with it. I find that I do not want to climb the corporate ladder, play the political games, and go above and beyond. This is a stark contrast of how I was always willing to do 110% up until recently. This line of thinking is very dangerous and once realizing this, it becomes difficult to continue and find peace with the corporate environment. If I grind and work extra hard, what is the real purpose of it for: To appease management, to get a measly raise, to be respected by others, to increase my own self-worth in a twisted way, or simply to just learn more things? Maybe I don't have a true passion for my work like some others might. Do some others just create this grind mentality for themselves because of the situation they put themselves in? I'm talking about living paycheck to paycheck, getting in debt for expensive cars, houses, or lifestyles that are not really affordable. By creating this struggle, do these people adopt this grind mentality because this is how they have to "survive"? Since most of us here understand budgeting, and how to spend less and invest, I've found that it creates less and less of a grind/struggle mentality for me. I'm finding it very difficult to just accept a corporate job and the things that come with it. The open office spaces, the bright white lights that burn your eyes, spending your day in front of the screen, the soulless look that everyone has. Last week the person in front of me, behind me, and to each side of me were all on a phone call and I couldn't form a single thought, and sat in my open office space like a vegetable. Just the other day my PM said that, "we need to get more bodies on this project". Bodies, isn't that a nice way to refer to potential co-workers. I think I've also dealt with a sabotage issue where a senior member helped me out with a solution for a project, only for it to be incorrect and having to start over in the development process, therefore making me look bad to our business team. Of course, this could have been an honest mistake, but this particular co-worker gives off those vibes and should have the intellect as a lead. I keep telling myself that I don't want to end up like my older co-workers, slowing dying in the office. What it comes down to is that I'm very bad at playing along and faking it enough. This, for me is how I get burnout, not from working too hard or too much. In the industry I work in, it is my understanding that another possible angle to this newfound corporate grind attitude could be indirectly caused by IT and tech departments/companies across the US using H1B visa workers. These companies would rather hire a cheaper H1B worker or foreigner, that will work till they die with no complaints for a green card. They are 100% loyal to the company and fearful of termination and loss of potential visas, being sent back to their country, or eventual citizenship if they stay in. A company can pay 70k to the contractor consulting firm and then they pay 50k to a foreign contractor to do the work of maybe a salary of 90k US citizen with no pushback. Therefore, reducing wages for US workers, while upping output indirectly to keep up, and also causing some terrible work environments. I may be wrong here, but I keep seeing this trend as long as I've been in the workforce with companies replacing certain US IT professionals with indentured servants. I think they aren't all H1B, but I am not super knowledgeable about the visa process. This post was inspired by a recent meeting with my manager, where I was told that I am not living up to what is expected of me, and that I am not asking for more work and being proactive with certain things. After coming up on 2 years in this particular professional/junior role, they were comparing me to other seniors with a decade or more of experience than me and saying that I do not measure up and have less on my plate then they do. Another issue is that honestly, I do not want to ask for more work, because I know it will be some shitty work that no one else wants and will not help me grow the skills I need. This is probably the wrong way to look at things though. This whole weekend I was thinking about how I need to structure my entire summer around training, studying, or finding ways to provide more value because my manager finds that I am not super ambitious. Maybe you do just have to grind early in your career, and things get better or easier. Maybe it's just this particular company. Maybe I am not a good fit for this role/area. What if I will never agree with corporate life? What if it's just me? Questions like this are healthy for some introspection, but are proving very difficult to move past. I do not want to be tied to my work, have my work define me, or become a workaholic, but it seems like this is what is expected out of you. Next is the balance part. How do you create balance in your life with a corporate career? There are certain needs in your life that needs to be taken care of: cleaning, cooking, washing clothes, etc. On top of that you are expected to be up-to-date with your industry so add in some studying, training, or overtime etc. Next up is the things that you actually really enjoy doing or your hobbies. Add in a significant other, a dog, family, friends, staying active and healthy, and this modern life just becomes a crazy balancing act and overwhelming. It takes a lot of energy and planning to properly do this at the cost of almost feeling like a robot. It seems like I'm getting closer to building the life I want to live, but it is pretty difficult to actually live it with work taking a significant amount of it directly, indirectly, mentally, and emotionally. Do I have to stop working out, stop walking the dog, stop meal-prepping and cooking, drop the SO? I know this is extreme but that is what it feels like. I've already taken steps to live close to work and a 10-minute commute is nice, but still it doesn't feel like it helps too much. This place also has some pretty great benefits. It's hard enough after a work day to have the energy to do the things that you need to do or would like to do. I'm sure as hell no one actually wants to sit on their couch after a work day and do nothing, but it happens more often than I would like. Maybe I should throw out the TV. Huge respect to those with kids because I seriously cannot fathom how you make it work. How do you handle this kind of stuff? Does anything make it easier? Do you have to swallow the corporate pill and become a drone to fully accept this is the way it is? If you couldn't tell, I am young in my career at 27, but have had corporate jobs/internships since 18. Is the goal of becoming FI strong enough to try to find peace with a corporate career? I know that most will probably advise to get a new job, which I've known for a while now. The vacation thing doesn't work anymore, I just took 2 weeks off and the burnout is still alive and well. I guess all I can do is hope that the next job may be a little better and continue my quest to find work that may be more agreeable or enjoyable. I think I'll specialize a bit more and transition to more of a developer role for now. It's the only solid plan I have at this point regardless of how I feel about another corporate job. Maybe I'll work towards trying out a 100% remote role after my skills are good and see if that will help. Maybe I'll give it all up and try something totally different. Good luck to all. [link] [comments]  |
| Instructions for family if I die before FIRE Posted: 17 Jun 2019 09:03 PM PDT My health is not that great and I am the only earner for my family (wife and 2 kids). I have invested in 401k, Roth IRA and regular taxable investment and life insurance. I named my wife as beneficiary in all the accounts. My wife never worked and doesn't know how to figure stuff out. I am leaving notes for her and wanted to seek your opinion on what I should focus on. Things in my mind - How to withdraw and which accounts to withdraw first - How to invest life insurance money - How to pass on to kids etc... Can you guys give some suggestions on this kind of instructions? Also things I need to do to (like estate planning) ensure safe transition. Thanks [link] [comments]  |
| Cincinnati, Dayton, Northern Kentucky showing "Playing With Fire". Posted: 18 Jun 2019 03:54 PM PDT Cincinnati, Dayton, Northern Kentucky showing of the financial independence themed documentary "Playing With Fire". August 7th, 2019. Please use link below to purchase tickets for this event. All of your favorite FIRE podcast and blog hosts are featured in this long awaited documentary! Buy tickets/get info here: https://www.tugg.com/events/playing-with-fire-5g0_. See movie trailer here: [link] [comments]  |
| Does it make sense to keep maxing out my 401k if I'm retiring in ~5 years? Posted: 18 Jun 2019 02:46 PM PDT Age 33. Details:
I've got a side-hustle that's been steadily paying me a huge chunk of money per month. At this rate, I'm only 38 months away from hitting my FIRE number, or maybe even less. I've been maxing out my 401k (and IRA) for the past few years. Considering the 10% early withdrawal penalty, and how close I am to hitting my FIRE number, should I keep maxing it out? At what point does the 10% early withdrawal penalty end up surpassing the compounded pre-tax interest? I'm struggling to figure out the math on that. EDIT: looks like I have some research to do about Roth conversion ladders. Thanks for the help guys! [link] [comments]  |
| Posted: 17 Jun 2019 11:15 PM PDT Just wondered if anyone has considered future developments in life extending medicine and the associated costs. I'm striving for FIRE but part of me is concerned that I'll retire with a fixed budget and if in the future some miracle medicine is available, it would be too costly to afford on my FIRE budget. I know many people will think this is nuts, but I love life. I want to explore all I can and if I could extend my healthy life, I'd definitely do it. I want to see space, I want to see what is out there, what other discoveries we can make, unlock the secrets of physics, of space travel, etc. I'm probably not going to see all of that but given the choice, what price would I pay? [link] [comments]  |
| Posted: 18 Jun 2019 08:18 AM PDT So, I've noticed in myself that I've become more interested in FIRE as I've gotten more stressed with my current job. I'm not happy working anymore like I used to be. I still have a huge drive to work and do a good job, but I want to choose what I do. I'm not happy with being voluntold to take on more and more responsibility with no extra time to complete my work or extra pay (honestly feels like I'm working two jobs). I'm not, big picture, happy. It seems like a lot of other people in this corner of reddit are pretty miserable too. For people who may have been in this position, has getting a new job that you liked better lessened your enthusiasm for FIRE? [link] [comments]  |
| What is the best stock to invest in? Posted: 18 Jun 2019 03:51 PM PDT |
| My wealthy financially independent family member wants to invest with me... help! Posted: 18 Jun 2019 01:36 PM PDT I hope this is the right place to post this - I'm hoping for someone who has been where I am now. I'm in my 30's, I'm a small real estate developer. I typically have around $500k working capital and my portfolio is in the $3-4MM range. I do projects that are very hands on, and where I can have a big personal impact if needed to control costs and help mitigate things outside my control (like market forces). I have a close relative who has been doing the entrepreneur, venture capital game for over a decade now. They have made multiple attempts at starting businesses and have recently had huge success and now own most of a company valued in the low 9 figures. Most of my family are conservative professionals and found my real estate business to be "risky," let alone my relative's continuous stream of longshot business ideas. I was always interested and supportive, and gave them advice specific to real estate when they needed it . Now they have decided to diversify and want to invest with me. The conversation was very casual and they mentioned they want to put "a couple of million" with me so I can "do what I do with it." They do know the specifics of my business and the model I use, which has been a slow but consistent grind over 15 years. I've never taken outside money (other than debt - mortgages and construction loans) because I've always been too worried about losing it, or the pressure that comes with spending other people's money. Plus, scaling up my business from $1-2MM projects that I can control and going to $5-10MM projects where I have less control is something I've never done. I've also never "pitched" an investment or a project to anyone. My relative is an expert at pitching, so I have no idea how to go about this... I'm pretty happy grinding out $300k/year plus the accruing passive income and growing equity but this could be my chance to jump to the next level and have a totally new lifestyle after a few years. Has anyone successfully had a family member invest with them? Anyone gone from the small one man shop to a bigger enterprise? I never experienced this type of paralysis and fear when I was starting out because it was so incremental that it was just one step at a time. Now I realize I'm standing at the top of a small pyramid and have to jump to the next rung, it's terrifying. Anyways, sorry if this is the wrong sub. I know this is just tangentially related to FI but I figured some people here might have gone through what I am facing. [link] [comments]  |
| A quick point of clarification on tax on gains in after tax money in 401k ? Posted: 18 Jun 2019 11:50 AM PDT Quick question that I can't seem to get a clear answer to. I would appreciate any insight! When doing a mega backdoor Roth are the gains on your after tax contributions taxed at the end of the year post rollover to Roth IRA? Ex: 1,000 in after tax contributions. 100 dollars in gains over the course of the year on those after tax contributions. Total to be rolled over from 401k to Roth IRA is 1,100 I understand that the 1000 goes into the Roth tax free (Bc it is post tax) and gains are now tax free at 59.5. But what about that 100 in gains. Once it is in the Roth I understand that gains on that are tax free. But do I have to pay taxes on the 100 at the end of the year once I make the rollover to Roth Bc it was interest gained on after tax money? Sorry if this is a repeat question. Appreciate it! [link] [comments]  |
| Posted: 18 Jun 2019 06:08 AM PDT Hey everyone! 27 year old who is fairly new to the FIRE journey. I have been aggressively saving at a 64% rate for the last two years and built a fairly in-depth plan for my financial goals and savings by age. My big question is how do you guys account for kids later in life? I'm single so this prospect is still a long way away, but I would definitely like to have a family later in life and want to account for ~2 kids in my FIRE plan. I understand that this will widely vary based on lifestyle but have read that ~500K is an appropriate plug number to support 22 years (including a good portion of a state college). Does that sound accurate? I live in a HCOL city and will likely stay in the area due to the increased earning potential. How have you all incorporated kids into your plan and have many folks still managed to retire in the 40-45 range while supporting them? [link] [comments]  |
| How long will I live INDEPENDENTLY in retirement? Posted: 17 Jun 2019 10:58 PM PDT Most people planning for retirement are probably familiar with the Soc. Security Amin's life expectancy calendar (https://www.ssa.gov/OACT/population/longevity.html) Just plug in your info and it'll tell you how long you are likely to live. However, not all of those years are created equal in cash outflow. Most folks will have their expenditures increase massively when they can't live independently (hospice care, senior care, daily help in-home, etc.). Does anybody know of a calculator or rule of thumb or table that can give me an estimate of how long I or anybody else can be expected to live without hired help? For simplicity, let's leave marriage out of the calculation... [link] [comments]  |
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