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    Financial Independence Daily FI discussion thread - June 12, 2019

    Financial Independence Daily FI discussion thread - June 12, 2019


    Daily FI discussion thread - June 12, 2019

    Posted: 12 Jun 2019 01:08 AM PDT

    Please use this thread to have discussions which you don't feel warrant a new post to the sub. While the Rules for posting questions on the basics of personal finance/investing topics are relaxed a little bit here, the rules against memes/spam/self-promotion/excessive rudeness/politics still apply!

    Have a look at the FAQ for this subreddit before posting to see if your question is frequently asked.

    Since this post does tend to get busy, consider sorting the comments by "new" (instead of "best" or "top") to see the newest posts.

    submitted by /u/AutoModerator
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    Are there any teachers here? How are you doing financially?

    Posted: 12 Jun 2019 12:22 PM PDT

    I am 22 with a degree in mathematics. I have been working in the actuarial field with a salary around 57k however, I hate the work. I am considering a switch into teaching but obviously that will really hurt my current salary and potential future salary.

    Thanks!

    submitted by /u/Xsammy183
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    Social circles after FIRE?

    Posted: 12 Jun 2019 05:53 AM PDT

    I'm on the cusp of FIRE, but curious about folks stories of how their social lives changed once they pulled the trigger. I'm not from nor do I run in wealthy circles. All of my friends have full time jobs and will for the foreseeable future. Even though I'm incredibly fortunate to be in this situation, I'm looking for stories about how people have managed this transition from a social standpoint.

    submitted by /u/megadelegate
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    In a relationship where the two have different financial values - how do you deal?

    Posted: 12 Jun 2019 03:37 PM PDT

    I am 6 years away from retirement and have worked hard to raise a son solo, own a home, have a great pension (Canada), and a solid financial portfolio.

    Problem? Been dating someone for two years who has a pension income but is terrible at saving money, ex: he borrows money to vaca. He was debt free one year ago after selling his house and is now 10 K in debt from daily living. And pulls in over 3500. a month in pension... note: he is very generous with me....

    How to reconcile different values...?

    submitted by /u/carmenincanada
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    Single people: When did you sit down and make a FIRE plan?

    Posted: 12 Jun 2019 01:59 AM PDT

    How old were you? If there was one, what was the defining moment?

    How long did you spend creating your plan? Who did you consult, if anyone?

    Did a potential partner factor into your thinking? If so, how?

    submitted by /u/ctrl-f-society
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    May - Monthly Case Study: Living aboard a sailboat full time

    Posted: 12 Jun 2019 12:53 PM PDT

    First Month's Case Study Post: April 2019
    May Overview:The month of May has been a crazy AND expensive to say the least. We had a major propane leak(we knew propane system needed a rebuild) which lead to a full rebuild of the propane system including a new stove. My wife took a trip to Israel while I stayed back and painted the boat. I have to rebuild and install the last 4 windows and then will be progressing on to some of the interior rebuild starting middle of June. Each day we are getting closer to being able to start sailing on a regular basis! Painting the boat took somewhere around 200 hours by my estimates. Most of that time was spent in the prep phase, but a professional paint job would have costed somewhere around $6500-$8000! By my estimates, materials costed somewhere around $600(though I haven't calculated it).
    Boat Repairs:

    • Replaced spinnaker halyards(2 of them)
    • New stove and propane system
    • Painted cabin top and cockpit)

    Budget Change:

    • Revised how I budget for each month
      • All categories are given a "total sum" in which we deduct from on a monthly basis. The remaining "sum" should never roll over into the following months and should be transitioned into "investing".
      • Moved investing categories into their own group
      • Split "investing" category into "Vanguard" and "Crypto"
      • "To be Budgeted" should never have funds for the month, rather all excess spending should come directly from "Vanguard" category.
    • Budget only 2 months worth of expenses rather than 3.

    GOALS:

    • To become FIRE by age 47 ($750,000 in investments)
    • Take 2 years off work to do a Pacific crossing aboard our sailboat
    • After FIRE? Who knows, maybe a 10 or 20 year circumnavigation?

    Life Situation: Seattle, WA. Age 28, partner 26
    (ESTIMATED)Gross Salary/Wages: Me: $95,000/year(salary)Wife(works per diem): ~$30,000/year
    Bonuses: Me:

    • Quarterly performance bonuses:
      • Q1: 14% - $3150

    Individual amounts of each Pre-tax deductions: Me(bi-weekly):

    • 401k: $237.51
    • Healthcare: $45.82
    • Dental: $16.56
    • Vision: $1.11
    • HSA: $273.29
    • Transit: $54.80

    Wife:

    • 401k: $100(fluctuates based on how much she works)

    INCOME:MONTHLY TOTAL: $ 7,734.73 AVERAGE(since Jan 2019): $ 8,841.24 TOTAL(since Jan 2019): $ 44,206.20
    EXPENSES: MONTHLY TOTAL: $8,013.45 AVERAGE(since Jan 2018): $6,806.87 % Difference from previous month: +11.45% TOTAL(since Jan 2018): $34,034.34
    ---------------------------IMMEDIATE OBLIGATIONS:

    • Moorage: $759.00
    • Phone: $132.69
    • Groceries: $354.72
    • Transportation: $230.20

    TOTAL: $1,476.61 AVERAGE: $1,700.19 % Difference from previous month: -14.29%
    ---------------------------TRUE EXPENSES:

    • Business Expenses: $184.73
    • Smokables: $40.00
    • Propane(cooking): $0
    • Heating(diesel heater): $0
    • Gas: $87.55
    • Auto Maintenance: $15.00
    • Boat Maintenance: $3,934.01
    • Gifts: $0
    • Software Subs: $16.48
    • Stuff I forgot to budget for: +$46.14(refund)
    • Auto Insurance: $0
    • Boat Insurance: $0
    • Medical Exp: $129.81

    TOTAL: $4,361.44 AVERAGE: $3,367.45% Difference from previous month: +33.52%
    ---------------------------Quality of Life:

    • Wife Spending: $65.32
    • Vacation: $1,080.31
    • My Spending: $98.81

    TOTAL: $1244.44 AVERAGE: $713.65% Difference from previous month: +88.19%
    ---------------------------Savings:

    • Vanguard: $87.99
    • Crypto: $570.00

    TOTAL: $657.99 AVERAGE: $794.51% Difference from previous month: -85.96%
    ---------------------------Just for Fun:

    • Dining Out: $196.56
    • Fun Money: $76.41

    TOTAL: $272.97 AVERAGE: $231.08% Difference from previous month: +30.86%
    ---------------------------Assets: Car: 1996 Toyota 4Runner - $3500Boat: 1980 Pacific International Marine: $40,000Stocks(Active management - Will move away to personal management soon): $79,262.44Vanguard Index Funds(Personally managed): $23,312.15Cash: $18,448.25

    submitted by /u/chowdan131
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    How much money would it take to get you to move to Casper Wyoming?

    Posted: 11 Jun 2019 07:47 PM PDT

    Stats

    24 years old

    Degrees in Finance & Energy Management

    75k net worth (40K in retirement and 25k in brokerage)

    Contractor currently making ~60k/year in Midwest

    I'm in Casper for a few weeks and have received a substantial bump in pay for coming up here. My boss has talked with me about potentially moving here, and has said my pay increase would remain (putting me at over $100k/year).

    That's more money than I ever dreamed I could be making at this age, but man I question the quality of life I'd have. The city is actually very nice, and the landscape is beautiful (at least compared to what I'm used to), but there just aren't any people here...

    This seems like an opportunity I can't pass up, but it also seems like I may regret spending the remainder of my 20s here.

    submitted by /u/PaulHarden
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    FIRE & the cost of healthcare - how are folks solving that ?

    Posted: 12 Jun 2019 04:23 AM PDT

    As a lurker in these parts I find the community fascinating. The positivity and thoughtfulness of contributions are frankly empowering !

    So now I put it to folks - when retiring early , how are people solving the issue of retaining good quality healthcare when not working for a company that provides it ?

    As I look around and ask friends who pay healthcare themselves these annual premiums are high. For example - in nyc a modest coverage for a family of 4 with relatively low deductible is in the range of 20k to 40k.

    That's a significant outflow of funds each year. Are FIRE folks generally just factoring this cost into retirement calcs or are there more creative ways around this issue ?

    Interested in the communities thoughts.

    submitted by /u/nykingham
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    Rental property Mortgage VS Cash

    Posted: 12 Jun 2019 03:31 PM PDT

    I'm buying my first rental property next month. This will be my first rental and I am wondering in your opinions would it be more advantageous to get a super small mortgage? (say 18k)
    Or pay for the entire place in cash (25k).

    The place has rental history and I can get $800 easily with no utility's included. I'm wondering is it better to take a loan and put the rent I will get toward the principle, allowing me to keep more cash in hand have some income?

    Or spend about half of my savings and have no mortgage?

    FYI I've been reading this sub for a while this is my first post on reddit. Thanks for taking the time to give me your input.

    submitted by /u/442AE
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    Weekly Self-Promotion Thread - June 12, 2019

    Posted: 12 Jun 2019 01:08 AM PDT

    Self-promotion (ie posting about projects/businesses that you operate and can profit from) is typically a practice that is discouraged in /r/financialindependence, and these posts are removed through moderation. This is a thread where those rules do not apply. However, please do not post referral links in this thread.

    Use this thread to talk about your blog, talk about your business, ask for feedback, etc. If the self-promotion starts to leak outside of this thread, we will once again return to a time where 100% of self-promotion posts are banned. Please use this space wisely.

    Link-only posts will be removed. Put some effort into it.

    submitted by /u/AutoModerator
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    What do you guys plan to do after you FIRE?

    Posted: 12 Jun 2019 07:41 AM PDT

    Aside from "travel" and "relax"...those things will get boring after a little while.

    I had a professor in college that got really lucky in the real estate bubble and sold at the very peak, then retired when he was like 33. Long story short, it took him about 10 years to figure out what he wanted to do. He had a difficult time figuring out a meaningful way to spend his time and how to balance his new hobbies vs spending time with his family. Ultimately he found his passion for teaching, so he taught at my university and got paid a salary of $1. (Technically I think he was required to get paid more than that, so he just donated everything back the university except for $1).

    Just curious what you all would do if you successfully FIRE. You'll have lots more free time and a full life ahead of you.

    EDIT: I would challenge you all to think about if your post-FIRE plans will really sustain you over the long haul. As I indicated in my post, some things like "relaxing", etc, sound like a dream, but get old really fast. At that point you realize you have a long life ahead of you, so you'll need to find something meaningful to do with your life. Feeling like you have no purpose will eat you alive.

    submitted by /u/Machiavelli127
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    35 yr old real estate entrepreneur stuck in a rut. Advice on the situation is greatly appreciated

    Posted: 12 Jun 2019 03:35 AM PDT

    I am a 35 yr old entrepreneur/real estate investor. I started my llc for real estate a little under 3 years ago. I started off wholesaling to kind of get my feet wet and learn the craft. I saved up a little cash doing so. About 2 month ago i secured 40k in business credit to help supplement liquid assets so as to not put all my eggs in one basket and have a little flexibility. The rut that im stuck is, to actively invest in flipping houses is i need about 25k in liquid asset. As it stands now i only have about 4k, which leaves me at a grand total of 21k. Ive thought about using my business credit to generate liquid capital, but not sure what would be lucrative. Ive thought about taking out a personal loan, but i can only borrow 15k, besides the fact that it would put me in deeper debt when the idea is financial freedom. The only debt i have is student loans and a 13k car loan, which will be paid off in the next 3 to 4 years. Any advice would be greatly appreciated

    Regards

    submitted by /u/solomonmicah
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    24 Years Old Trying to be done with my 9-5 by 26. Suggestions Needed!

    Posted: 12 Jun 2019 03:15 PM PDT

    Hello all,

    First-time poster in this space. Thank you in advance for all of the help and insight that you provide to each user on here. It is awesome to see and I know my post is long.

    My story: Originally from Illinois, I moved to sunny Arizona for college because it is a cheaper version of paradise than California (I have now grown to love it here though). I graduated in 2017 with a B.S. in Marketing and unsure what to do with it. I had about 5k to my name at the time of graduation from working in college - taking trips with your friends to Cabo and such doesn't help promote a saving friendly lifestyle. I moved into a house with some friends that we were renting.

    I took a job in a software sales role in Phx (75k/yr) and worked there for about 6 months before I realized that I was not meant to work from 8-5 every single day doing the same thing (as many of you here feel). I am a person who truly enjoys living a life filled with social interaction, varied settings, challenges, and creativity. Having a job that ties you down and makes you bored really feels draining and doesn't allow one to be as happy as they potentially can. I quickly searched around for what I could do to not stay in this lifestyle until I turned 65. My father had done that, as well as all my friend's parents, and I saw every day how unhappy and unfulfilled they seemed.

    After a quick search, I found this community online and like everyone else who makes the discovery, became instantly hooked and read through as many posts as I could. I also found a book called Set For Life by Scott Trench which I fell in love with and highly recommend. I now had my mind made up that I was going to work until 30 years old and once I had built up enough real estate, I could retire and live off the passive income and do other things I was passionate about.

    Well, I worked for another year at that software company, and saved up a bunch, before leaving to another software sales company as it was a progressive step up for me. Same pay but potential to earn more over time. I have been there for about 5 months now. The same story; the company is fun but the job is the same exact tasks every single day. Over the last year, I got my best friend and roommate to become excited about retiring from this work and share the same goal as me. We bought 3 houses, one that we live in and house hack, and the other two we rent out.

    The rentals are doing well and overall we are cash flowing about $1,200 a month. Nothing too crazy but definitely a great feeling. For me to quit my job, I would need to bring in 3,500 a month in passive income so I can feel comfortable. If we keep up the pace of saving and buying property, we will be on track to cash flow about $7,000 a month combined by the time we are 30. HOWEVER, call me spoiled or impatient, but being a salesperson and a fan of Grant Cardone, I want to 10x my goals and be done here by 26.

    That being said I am trying to figure out ways that I can bring in passive income to help me achieve this goal. Here are some of the things that I currently also do: Teach a cycling class 2x a week at a studio ($250/month), enjoy taking photos of things/people. ($40/month from random jobs).

    I was thinking of doing a blog because those can make good money, but I am unsure on whether to make it about my life or saving money, or achieving FI or what and if people would follow it enough to bring in money.

    What suggestions do you guys have?

    submitted by /u/Treepizza
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    How do you mentally handle an unexpected expense/setback? I recently started the FIRE journey and now have to replace my HVAC.

    Posted: 12 Jun 2019 07:24 AM PDT

    In the past I have been financially responsible in comparison to my peers but that's not saying much. With the help of this sub, I am trying to adjust my spending and get serious about saving. However, this weekend I found out that my 20 year old air conditioner is on its last leg. Looking at the cost of a new unit is incredibly overwhelming and makes me feel defeated.

    How do you bounce back and stay motivated after a set back like this?

    submitted by /u/curatedlurking23
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    Index Fund Income vs Rental Income

    Posted: 11 Jun 2019 09:02 PM PDT

    Say you had 2,000,000 million dollars to invest.

     

    Index Fund Route  

    Gross = $70,000 (2,000,000 * 3.5% Withdrawal Rate)  

    Net = $50,000 (Gross * (1 - 30% Income Tax Rate))

     

    Rental Income Route  

    In my area, $2,000,000 could be converted into about 8 single family homes. I can rent them for about $1,500 a piece.

      Gross=$144,000 (8 units * $1500 *12 Months)

      Gross Minus Expenses/Taxes = $72,000 (Using the 50% rule recommended by bigger pockets)

      Net = $50,400 ($72,000 * (1 - 30% Income Tax Rate))

     

    Do these calculation seem accurate? Or am I missing something? Both approaches have almost the same exact ROI despite the fact that Rental Properties take significantly more time and effort to manage. I understand that in the long run, you'll come out ahead with real estate because of property appreciation, but I guess I was surprised at how small the difference is. I really hope I'm missing something...

    submitted by /u/herooftime168
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