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    Thursday, July 5, 2018

    Financial Independence What's the toughest financial decision you've had to make within the last year?

    Financial Independence What's the toughest financial decision you've had to make within the last year?


    What's the toughest financial decision you've had to make within the last year?

    Posted: 05 Jul 2018 03:02 PM PDT

    Daily FI discussion thread - July 05, 2018

    Posted: 05 Jul 2018 04:08 AM PDT

    Please use this thread to have discussions which you don't feel warrant a new post to the sub. While the Rules for posting questions on the basics of personal finance/investing topics are relaxed a little bit here, the rules against memes/spam/self-promotion/excessive rudeness/politics still apply!

    Have a look at the FAQ for this subreddit before posting to see if your question is frequently asked.

    Since this post does tend to get busy, consider sorting the comments by "new" (instead of "best" or "top") to see the newest posts.

    submitted by /u/AutoModerator
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    Interesting data about high income earners

    Posted: 05 Jul 2018 04:18 PM PDT

    I've been looking for this study from the Cato Institute for quite some time. I think it speaks a lot to situations that pop up here. People have high paying positions young in life and are questioning whether they should bail and risk not being able to break back into that income strata or should just ride the lightening.

    The churning of high income earners is pretty amazing. The study found that "[s]ome 94 percent of Americans who reach "top 1 percent" income status will enjoy it for only a single year. Approximately 99 percent will lose their "top 1 percent" status within a decade."

    I very much ascribe to the "make hay while the sun shines" mentality and think that studies like this can serve as a reminder that high income can be a fickle, fleeting affair. Thoughts?

    Edit: I really like /u/SeriouslyJoking88's comment. A massive problem I have with mainstream retirement planning advice is that it tends to suggest a fixed rate of saving to hit a retirement goal over a very long time. American's incomes are not guaranteed, are often interrupted by periods of unemployment, and do not grow at a fixed rate. Someone saving 10%-15% may be in for a violently rude awakening if they find that they suffer a stint of long term unemployment in their 40s and cannot find good paying work again.

    submitted by /u/GreedyPhrase
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    This subreddit has really helped get my life on the right track, THANK YOU Financial Independence!!

    Posted: 04 Jul 2018 06:05 PM PDT

    To explain how I started here - Last Christmas break off from work I had some time off to really think. I had an epiphany about how I had just been completely neglecting the financial part of my life, just utterly careless and letting money happen to me instead of me happening to money. So I started to take responsibility and do something about it, it started with this subreddit.

    During these past 6 months I've been lurking and posting here trying to adamantly follow all the advice and absorb as much information as I could from all the generous and knowledgeable posters on this sub. I've consumed countless articles, I watched probably upwards of a hundred YouTube videos and lectures on finances/saving/investing/wealth accumulation. Most importantly I started literally tracking every single damn dollar that was coming in and out of my control and held myself accountable for every purchase.

    After applying what I've learned so far to the best of my ability starting at $18,000 Net-Worth I've managed to increase it to $34,000 Net-Worth

    That may not seem like a whole lot compared to many of the older and more financially seasoned posters on this sub, but seeing some tangible results after all this time was a huge deal for me and I just really wanted to share it. (I'm 25 y/o male for reference).

    I sincerely wanted to say, THANK YOU everyone for all your help. I've learned so much about what to do with money here (and what not to do also lol). It's put me on the right path and given me a lot of confidence going forward. I may not be filthy rich one day who knows, that's ok. I just know my future self 15-30 years from now is going to remember what I learned and I'll be way better off because of it.

    Here is to trying to double it by the end of the year!

    Cheers - Roy

    submitted by /u/Incubus93
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    37, no debt, only 5k in asset via cash, US, finally in a position to save 30-40k a year here on out. Am I fucked still for FI? Feeling so far behind.

    Posted: 04 Jul 2018 09:54 PM PDT

    You could say I'm very late to the game. I've spent the last 4 years correcting my previous 15 years. I have no real assets other than 5k in cash as emergency fund. I do have a paid off older car that is perfect. I just opened a Roth, put 1500 in. I have zero debt. Great credit though. After all my bills, including fun money. I can save about 30-40k a year

    When I do the math on FI it seems so daunting, overwhelming.

    Is this going to be possible for me?

    Edit: I first posted at home and could respond to everyone. When I woke up, I had a lot of replies, which I'm reading every single one, and appreciate every single one. However I won't have time to reply to each one. I'll upvote though. I just wanted you to know I'm still engaging in the thread and appreciate every response even if I can't reply to each one.

    submitted by /u/Tossawaycausefriends
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    FIRE - Green Card/Tax considerations (planning endgame/exit)

    Posted: 05 Jul 2018 04:28 PM PDT

    Hello,

    I'm a Canadian citizen who's been working in the US for the last 12+ years.

    I've been on a green card for the last 5-ish years.

    I'm fortunate to have done well for myself, and am considering early retirement within the next ~5 years.

    I'm not sure yet what I want to do... Stay in the US? Move back to Canada? Move to Southeast asia and live like a king? :D

    ... but for all the possibilities, I'd like to know what my options are, in terms of not having to bleed all my money out in US taxes.

    • Applying for US citizenship: That'd be quite practical inside the country, but it has some downsides:
      1. If I decide to leave, I have to deal with having to pay US taxes for the rest of my life. This would be fine in Canada (tax treaty), but in another country, I'd probably be hosed.
      2. I'm also from an EU country, and today, I could easily get an EU passport as well. I worry about the consequences of getting US citizenship... I hear you have to renounce everything else... I know I can recapture Canadian as a dual citizen, but the rest, who knows... I will be consulting an immigration lawyer about this stuff...
    • Keeping the green card: Benefit is, I could basically hang around in the US for as long as I please, and until I decide to leave for good. Downside is, apparently after you've held a GC for 8 years, the expatriation tax becomes way worse, so... if I don't become a US citizen, it may be most beneficial to leave in under 3 years...

    I'd love to hear some thoughts about this, as I'm sure some folks in here have had to deal with this kind of situation before. I plan to consult an immigration lawyer, an estate lawyer, and a CPA whose customers are mostly expats/inpats, but I'd like to see what basic knowledge/understanding folks on here might have. :)

    Thanks for taking the time, I appreciate it!

    submitted by /u/SignificantViolinist
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    Checkup on DINKs

    Posted: 05 Jul 2018 12:40 PM PDT

    Life Situation: Married couple (I am 25, husband is 37) - DINKs, no plans for kids - would like to retire myself around the time my husband is able to retire with his pension in 15 years, so not insanely early. Luckily, we both have jobs that we're passionate about and enjoy - but we also don't want to die in our offices. We live in a low cost midwestern city.

    Gross Salary/Wages:
    Me: $75,000
    Husband: $64,500
    Total Gross: $139,500 (total bonus between both of us is often around $9,500, but we don't count on this and I'm ignoring it for purposes of this case study) ($11,625/month)

    Automatic Retirement Plans and Investments
    Pretax: My 401k: Balance of $5,000, contributing $6,750/year including 3% match - contributing $346.16 of this, employer $216.34

    Pretax: His 401k: Balance of $5,000, contributing $6,750/year (no match) - contributing $539.42/month, employer $23.08

    His Contribution to Pension: $173.52 (mine fully covered by employer)

    Post tax: Joint Brokerage Account: Balance of $10,000 - contributing $9,000/year or $750/month

    Taxes, etc

    State Taxes: $422

    Federal Taxes: $1376.58

    Social Security: $674.20

    Medicare: $157.68

    Other (Dental/Vision/Life): $33.52

    Charitable Contribution Before Tax: $50

    Post tax:Joint Brokerage Account: Balance of $10,000 - contributing $9,000/year or

    Total Net after taxes and above investments: $6419.17 (we are paid biweekly and budget that way - multiplying everything x2 to see our monthly budget, which doesn't account for extra paychecks some months - keeps us a bit more conservative)

    Current expenses (monthly):
    Mortgage: $1436 (Owe $220,000 on home worth $240,000 - paid $235k - 4% on the mortgage, 30 year fixed, 29 years remaining)

    Extra Mortgage Payment: $1500 monthly (major question is whether we should continue this - goal was to make extra payments until PMI is eliminated once we hit $188,000 owed - and then begin investing this amount in our brokerage account - PMI is only $76.28/month so although I've done a few calculators that show a good return on paying this down early, I am interested in outside opinions)

    Vehicles (two): $840 - one will be paid off in two years, the other in five (3.99% - two years to go, around $10k owed, 2013 Nissan subcompact SUV, 3.99% - five years to go, $20k owed, 2017 Buick Subcompact SUV)
    Car Insurance: $121.04
    Electricity: $100
    Gas: $65
    Internet: $60
    Water/Trash/etc: $108
    Recurring Subscriptions: $47.96
    Cell Phones: $145
    Apple Upgrade Plan: $40.76
    Food: $500
    Vacation: $300 (approximately $3600/year)
    Entertainment: $120
    Clothing: $300
    My Student Loan: $218.82 (1 year into 10 years of Public Service Loan Forgiveness...Owe $54,000 altogether for undergrad and graduate degree --- income based repayment will go up slightly next year)
    Total: $5,902.58 ($70,830.96/year)

    Emergency Fund/Checking Accounts (all earning 1.49\%): $25,000

    Expected ER expenses:
    Husband's pension kicks in in 15 years. We would both like to retire at that point (he will be 52, I will be 40) without changing our lifestyle substantially. My student loan should be eliminated via PSLF by that point, we anticipate monthly expenses won't include two car payments or the extra mortgage payment either... Still, we would like to budget for increased travel and of course health care costs at that stage. We anticipate needing approximately $75,000 annually. His pension should cover $40,000 of this (for his life and mine as survivor).

    One other note: I also have a pension, which will not kick in until I turn 60 - if I quit working in 15 years, it will add about $24,000 to our income.

    If you consider our extra mortgage payment part of our overall investment plan (which it is - and after PMI is eliminated, will go to our brokerage acct), we're investing $40,500/year ($6750x2 - 401ks, $9000 brokerage, $18k extra mortgage payments). Just a quick investment return calculator shows me that with 6% returns, we should be approaching $1 million in 15 years (we invest bonuses as well - and incomes will likely increase slightly in that time frame as well). So, I'm thinking - looking ahead, a 4\% draw from that - along with his pension - should put us at around $80k/year. Ignoring, of course, things that will kick in further down the road like my pension and social security.

    So a few questions:
    1. Overall, are we on the right track to make this happen? Any recommendations? I know we could be more frugal - but we're not looking to retire asap, just at a specific point 15 years down the road.

    1. Are we doing the right thing paying down the mortgage to eliminate PMI and THEN putting that money towards our investments?

    2. Am I doing the right thing by counting on PSLF for my student loan and making the minimum payment for ten years? I plan to remain in eligible employment throughout that period...

    submitted by /u/ccoll04r
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    How to deal with wealth inequality with partner?

    Posted: 04 Jul 2018 09:33 PM PDT

    Me and my partner have a house now, which we are paying off together. I will inherit a larger and much better house soon, so i would like to move there and rent out our current place.

    Problem is, if we move there the house will be all mine and she is afraid it will cause an imbalance in our relationship. If we go trough a tough time she would be scared of being kicked out basically. While i have no intent of doing so i understand her position of needing a sense of security and equality in the relationship.

    I try and convince her with the fact she still owns half of our current house, and she will get to put the money aside she doesn't have to spend on the mortgage each month.

    So, how to best deal with this situation? Selling the house is not an option to me.

    submitted by /u/nabuko_donosor
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    What am I missing?

    Posted: 05 Jul 2018 06:38 AM PDT

    I'm firmly in the "plugging away" stage but close enough to be thinking about the details. I'm 42yo, expecting FI at 45 and possibly RE at 50. That will put me as a retiree with a wife, 12 and 14 yo kids, and a 15 yo (paid off) house. I'm getting a good handle on current expenses but what will pop up and surprise me? Or what am I failing to plan for?

    Am already considering:

    -Health insurance

    -1-2 used cars for kids and insurance

    -4-5 more cars over my and wife's lifetime

    -Continuing to contribute to 529s

    -Wedding fund

    -House stuff: roof, water heater, mid-major renovations (I'm a little clueless here if anyone has projections I'd love to hear them)

    -Elder care...I don't think I'll be on the hook for my parents but I should have a plan. Same for myself and wife, eventually.

    What else??

    To head off some comments, I know I don't need to pay for cars, college and weddings, but our parents set us up to be debt free and I think it is one of the best things we can do for our kids lasting health and happiness (along with teaching good nutrition habits).

    Edit: formatting

    submitted by /u/gcg2016
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    Foolish not to use a financial advisor?

    Posted: 05 Jul 2018 04:57 AM PDT

    Many of my peers (late 20s) are beginning to work with financial advisors, although none are focused on FIRE, just to prepare themselves for when they retire at 60.

    Is it foolish to not use one? I think I've got a fair grasp of what I'm doing but don't want to be overconfident in myself. I'm not sure if many people who FIRE are using financial advisors or just going at it themselves

    submitted by /u/SRB0419
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    Beginners book advice

    Posted: 04 Jul 2018 07:15 PM PDT

    I'm trying to get a couple young 20-somethings onto the lean fire path. We're from the Midwest so they've been brainwashed pretty hard with the "get a good job and work yourself to the bone and then you'll be just magically rich one day" mindset. They're interested in FIRE but they're not big readers. What would be a good book to gift them that meets most of the following?:

    ●Simple language to keep them from getting turned off

    ●Explains that the true cost of something is the alternatives you sacrifice, such as buying investments instead of financing luxuries.

    ●The psychological aspects of anti-materialism; how McMansions and super cars don't make you happy due to the hedonic treadmill, but freedom from stress and novel experiences will.

    ●The philosophical aspects of FI, how wealth isn't about winning the rat race, it's about empowering yourself to live a more fulfilling life.

    ●How you don't have to have an amazing job to retire young, because what you keep is more important than what you make (cashflow).

    Edit: Why am I being down voted so much?

    submitted by /u/dataisking
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    Early 30s professionals & long time lurker. Financial check-up.

    Posted: 05 Jul 2018 06:30 AM PDT

    Hi,

    I lurk around here a lot but have never posted. I know we are fortunate with our incomes and I think we are in a very good spot. I feel like I am on auto-pilot but given how taboo finances are any my wife's lack of interest in them I wanted to check-in and see if anyone from this sub has any advice for me and my family.

    Below is our financial make-up. All comments/critique welcome.

    I am really looking for advice on what if anything would people change? What would you do in the next 5 or so years if you were me? Do you think our current assets match our larger goal to quit the rat race in the next 12 or so years?

    Stats:

    • Early 30s (33/32)
    • Dual income
    • 1 young child, planning on one more
    • VHCOL area

    Paycheck/bonuses/other incoming funds:

    • Bi-weekly paychecks after deductions and taxes: $12,500 (about $27000 monthly)
      • Maxing out 2 401k's
      • Maxing out 2 HSA's
      • Maxing out 1 ESPP @ 10% income
    • Typically receive around 150k in post tax cash bonuses in the first quarter of the year between the two of us and place in taxable brokerage
    • Typically receive around 150k in post tax stock awards in the first quarter of the year between the two os us
    • Typically receive 28k from parents and 10k for child's trust. Historically we have used the 28k as the following years vacation fund

    Expenses/Investments:

    • Bi-weekly contribution to taxable brokerage account: $5,000
    • Bi-weekly contribution to savings account: $2,500. When savings balance hits $60,000 I put $10,000 into Vanguard and rinse and repeat. This is my version of two-layered DCA.
    • Rent (monthly): $3,800
    • Daycare (monthly): $3,300
    • Wife's care lease (monthly): $300
    • Bi-weekly for food, gas, dog stuff and general enjoyment: $1,300

    Liabilities:

    • None. Just finished paying off the last of my wife's loans.

    Assets:

    • Cash: $50,000
    • HSAs: $9,000
    • 401ks: $330,000
    • Roth IRAs: $77,000
    • Taxable Brokerage: $605,000
    • Company stock (3 year vesting): $170,000
    • Kid's college account: $10,000
    • Retention agreement (pays out end of 2019): $375,000 pre-tax

    Goals/thoughts:

    • We would like retire by 45 and spend time traveling and embarrassing our children
    • My wife badly wants to buy a house to support our growing family but at the same time is not in love with her job and we would consider moving to a LCOL area or internationally once my retention agreement expires. As a result I am inclined to push renting through the end of 2019.
    • Career upside for both of us is pretty significant in our current roles. I see a greater than 50% chance of one of us doubling our incomes in the next 2-3 years if we stay put.
    submitted by /u/quickficheckup
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    TSP contribution question

    Posted: 04 Jul 2018 05:32 PM PDT

    So I'm in the military and way late to the game, but i'd like to start now.

    I have a lot of money in savings but i'd rather begin putting it towards a retirement fund.

    So this money is already taxed, am i able to make max contributions (18,500 for this year, 6,000 catchup for last) from the money that i already have in a nice quick lump sum, or does it NEED to come from my paycheck every month?

    I can't seem to google the answer anywhere.

    I'd like to be FIRE by the age of 43, we (my wife and i) are able to put aside around 5k a month, i figure a portion of it can go to a TSP and the rest invested in a different way.

    Your responses are much appreciated!

    submitted by /u/Nitesen
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